View Full Version : Server transcoding application running on a PC?
been reading a lot on these forums about limitations of the xbox playing certain files, and not having enough processing power to play hdtv files etc.
had a thought that you could write a server program which sits on a pc, and uses the windows codecs that are on the system, to decode all the video/audio streams, before sending the raw output data over the network cable.
although this wont work for files stored on an xbox, it would provide a neat way of streaming video over the network, letting another computer use it's own processing power, and the xbox just has to play raw data.
there isn't enough network bandwidth to do that.
even at ntsc res you're looking at 40 mb/s for a 30 fps stream. the xbox network interface peaks at about 10-11 mb/s
ummm it peaks at 10/11?? but it's a 10/100 network card, it should be able to handle up to 100 megabits per second?? *plus other boxes do that too i believe, like the hauppauge media mvp. *and cant the xbox media center can play uncompressed files as it is?
icehot, you're only making a fool of yourself. :blush:
this is a (former) developer you're choosing not to believe.
hint; megabit is not the same as megabyte :lol:
firstly i know what a megabit is, i have a degree in computer science. and i do believe him, i never said i didnt. i'm asking him questions so i can learn more about it, i'm not trying to sound rude and like i dont believe him.
all i can say is, i saw what you wrote and you clearly confused mbit vs mbyte
butcher;
even at ntsc res you're looking at 40 mb/s
icehot;
ummm it peaks at 10/11?? but it's a 10/100 network card, it should be able to handle up to 100 megabits per second
well i may have done, i do know the difference but all he said was mb, which could be interpretted both ways. if he meant 40 megabytes per second, then fair enough, and that would all make sense. i appologise for anything i said which may have been taken the wrong way.
it is indeed a confusing matter, thats why i always write bit or bytes
but 40mbit for uncompressed video is unrealistic, so i didnt think it could've been misunderstood
hehe well it was, and i'm a network programmer, however i dont know as much about video as i probably should as that's not my area of expertise.
i may actually later though test the xbox with playing an uncompressed avi file or something though, to see what results that achieves.
Gamester17
2005-01-28, 13:26
mb (lower-case "b") = megabit (always!), mb (captial "b") = megabyte (always!), ....but it ispartially moot point anyway, you can already do what you want with vlc (link to 'how-to') (http://www.xboxmediaplayer.de/cgi-bin/forums/ikonboard.pl?act=st;f=8;t=4111).
...though butcher is right, there is not enough bandwith for a uncompressed 720p/1080i hdtv stream on a 100mb (megabit) network which is only what the xbox nic supports :hmm:
ok point taken, suppose i'll have to wait till xbox 2 comes out for that kind of stuff then, was just an idea anyway.
holdqwer
2005-03-30, 20:02
could an xbox ( that can display 480p 720p and 1080i ) be used as a conduit for hd content that had already been decoded by a 3ghz pc on a fast ethernet network?
in essense as a dumb terminal for getting the video to the monitor?
seems like it should be possible.
you must be dreaming
so you would do what, send raw hdtv over 100mbit? any idea what bitrate we're talking here ?
holdqwer
2005-03-30, 21:21
i guess that is a bit unrealistic.
i'm not sure what kind of bit rate that would be.
i'll read up and find out.
thanks for not slamming me and my question.
i'd much rather be referred to as a dreamer than a twit.
**** found this out *****
http://www.google.ca/search?....=search (http://www.google.ca/search?hl=en&safe=off&q=%22uncompressed+hdtv%22&btng=search)
the uncompressed smpte-292 media stream comprises an rtp/udp/ip flow at approximately 1.5 gbps.
maybe the truth of being a twit may be more beneficial
lifo2001
2007-07-01, 15:04
How about decoding hd video on pc and then streaming it to xbox. Is this possibel. So we use the power of the pc for decoding not the xboxes (pc broadcastin/multicasting) to xboxes or other software streaming servers. This way their would not be a hardware problem anymore.:cool:
this idea is about 4 years old!
and no it's not possible to stream RAW 1080i over 100mbit, neither do I think the xbox hardware could handle it, xbox is a machine from 2000
lifo2001
2007-07-01, 16:20
The raw 1080i stream only uses 50Mbit at best so that shouldnt be a problem on the hardware side. Did someone do research in this way? Maybe we should look at standalone HD software streaming client (i can't think of any right now) and its software solution.
jmarshall
2007-07-02, 01:12
Perhaps there's an error in my calculations, but I find:
Uncompressed 1080i = 1920*1080*12 bits per frame (assuming full Y plane, and 1/4 u/v planes).
That's 24.8Mbits per frame.
So with 50Mbits/s data connection you'll only get 2 frames/second.
Need 600Mbits/s for 24fps, and 1.5Gbps for 60fps.
Perhaps some sort of compression may be used to get it down a bit, but I doubt you'll achieve 30:1 compression while still being able to decompress fast enough for display.
Cheers,
Jonathan
could you possibly compress it and decompress it with the texture compression logic on the gpu?
jmarshall
2007-07-02, 03:50
It can compress a 32bit texture by a factor of 1:8 (effectively 4bits/pixel) and is quite lossy at doing so.
We're talking about 12 bits per pixel here, so you only gain by a factor of 3 - still no where near close enough to fit into a 100mbits/sec stream.
You'll still need a further compression method, most likely lossy.
ultrabrutal
2007-07-02, 15:21
For movies you do not need all 1080 lines, only about 910 lines with an OAR movie.
For Xbox forget about 1080i it performs way too slow so target should be 720p which means around 540 lines OAR and of course 720 fullframe which we will also forget about. That's still only enough for 12 uncompressed frames and we need 24 but down to a factor of 2 which is not that hard to do fast lossy encode/decode of I believe
A dual core CPU would be ideal, one for decoding VC1 frames and one for encoding Xbox frames
An alternative would be to use divx/xvid which Xbox decodes fine at 1280x720p with digital sound output...
ultrabrutal
2007-07-02, 15:55
btw, there needs to be up to 3mbit left of the 100mbit per second for DTS/Dolby track (HD)
Is There A Way Or A Feature You Could Add Or A Script That Would Use The Pc's Processor And Stream The Video Through The Xbmc? I Have Vp7 Coded Videos That Require Much Faster Cpu Than What The Xbox Can Support. The Picture Skips On The Xbox But Does Not On The Pc. This Is Why I'm Asking If Its Possible To Watch The Video Like You Normally Do Through Xbmc But Have The Pc Control The Processor Instead Of Using The Xbox Processor? ???
ShortySco
2007-09-10, 16:59
As far as i know it's not currently possible.
I'd think technically it is though, but if it was HD content, it'd mostly have to be transcoded to a lower definition even though you decode it with the PC CPU.
Could be wrong, but i'm pretty sure that's the case.
Shorty
ciccioermeglio
2008-06-12, 01:11
Hi all, excuse me for my bad english.
I know that xbox hasn't enough power to play 720p files. But, if play a 720p file from my dual core pc and stream it with ethernet 100mbit cable to my xbox, is it able to play the file smoothly? ???
where it reads the file from is utterly irrelevant
ciccioermeglio
2008-06-12, 02:00
where it reads the file from is utterly irrelevant
Ok, but isn't there a way to delegate most of the work the PC processor and leave to the xbox only to read the packages and decode them?
I mean a stuff like stream my games http://www.streammygame.com/smg/index.php
Or we can use programs like vlc by, leaving the PC( that works as server) the heaviest work.
ciccioermeglio
2008-06-12, 02:08
Ok, but isn't there a way to delegate most of the work the PC processor and leave to the xbox only to read the packages and decode them?
I mean a stuff like stream my games http://www.streammygame.com/smg/index.php
Or we can use programs like vlc by, leaving the PC( that works as server) the heaviest work.
ok, i'm sorry. My question is just posted and there isn't any solution :sad:
i hope in a 360mod for run xbmc as xbox1 :sad:
tarrence13
2008-08-01, 20:53
Would it be possible to setup xbmc in such a way that I have a powerful server that runs the software and then "streams" the interface to my TV's? I basically want one server and then 5 TV's that can each have their own independent interface and watch different things.
Sorry for the vague wording I have no idea how to describe it. It's kind of like what air liners have where one server serves the application to all the TV's and each TV doesn't have its own computer.
Rand Al Thor
2008-08-01, 23:04
You can easily build a barebones computer for each tv with the sole purpose of running xbmc. It would not have to be very expensive if that is all you are using it for. Then you could have a server to feed all of your music, movies, music etc. That is what I have done. The search button is your friend. You could have easily answered this question for yourself.
You can easily build a barebones computer for each tv with the sole purpose of running xbmc. It would not have to be very expensive if that is all you are using it for. Then you could have a server to feed all of your music, movies, music etc. That is what I have done. The search button is your friend. You could have easily answered this question for yourself.
Don't think this is what he is after. He wants basically a "dumb terminal" at each TV with the more powerful back-end machine doing the decoding etc. top stream to the TVs. Not sure how that really works TBH short of something akin to VNC and agree a box at each system would be better. Maybe figure out a way to just have a server and PXE boot the other machines from the server? this would allow you to only have to maintain ONE copy of the software - would be nice for many TVs I'd think.
Gamester17
2008-08-02, 00:19
No, XBMC does not support any type of 'thin-client (http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Thin_client)' setup, all clients need to be a 'fat-client (http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Fat_client)' (thick = full computers), ...you could however have one server that shares all media files, see => http://xbmc.org/wiki/?title=NAS
and
http://xbmc.org/wiki/?title=Media_Sources
http://xbmc.org/wiki/?title=Types_of_Media_Sources
http://xbmc.org/wiki/?title=Adding_Media_Sources