Xbox or AppleTV [Archive] - XBMC Community Forum

uwer

2009-02-19, 19:07

AFAIK, the 360 doesn't have wireless LAN unless you get the wireless adapter for it, same as the original Xbox.

There is no version of XBMC for the 360, because it hasn't been hacked in any practical manner, yet.

For the original Xbox (or the 360, I guess) you'll need an ethernet to wireless bridge or this:
Forum link (http://xbmc.org/forum/showthread.php?t=34161&highlight=xbox+wireless)

Both Xboxes are pretty noisy in their stock condition. You might wanna take that into consideration when planning on using them as a media player.

I'm using an original Xbox, that I modified. The cooling fan has been replaced with a quieter one and the harddisk with a quieter model with more storage capacity.
You'll want the remote kit to be able to use an infrared remote.
I'd also recommend an IR-Hack to be able to remotely switch the Xbox on and off, a feature that the remote kit doesn't offer but comes in very handy if your box hangs. Its just so much more elegant and convenient than having to get up and press the power button.

The 360 offers video playback through UPnP, I don't know if it supports DLNA but i suspect so. It is a bit choosey about the AVI files it wants to play back. I have one and I tried with TVersity. With a good UPnP server and a decently powerful computer on which said server is running, you should be able to transcode on the fly, which should make the 360 more flexible. There have been many articles on xbox-scene.com about that. I haven't tried any, so it's up to you, if you want to take that road.

HTH, uwer

fiendmish

2009-02-19, 19:32

Hi There,

thought I would chip in as i have just started using AppleTV with XBMC. In general i find it really good, its taken some time to get things set up how i want and so they work smoothly. You mentioned the speed of the interface, that's defiantly something that i have noticed especially when using teh media heavy skins like Aeon and Horizonz. I do think that a MacMini would handle such things much better.

On the plus side it is silent. i mean not a whisper which is great
On the negative side (and this goes for the MacMini as well) the remote only has 6 buttons and while ostensibly you can use a universal remote getting it set up right appears to require determination and some knowledge of voodoo.

Back in the day i used to run XBMC on my Xbox and loved it, now am running it on Apple TV and loving it even more.

Hope that helps a bit in your decision :)

pp540

2009-02-23, 02:53

Hi fiendmish,
have you had any lag issues when you try to play .mkv files? Especially which are made for 1080p? I'm considering the apple TV vs the popcorn hour 110 just to stick with more mainstream vendors. Also I've heard some strange things about popcorn anyway. Any advice is welcome in my decision making process.

fiendmish

2009-02-23, 17:38

Hiya,

Haven't tried any 1080p ones, my TV sadlys isnt up to that so haven't got any in my library. Tried a few 720p MKV files the other day (streamed of a NAS drive) and they played fine.

I read somewhere that XBMC on ATV might struggle with true HD content as it doesn't get to use the same processors as quicklime running natively.

Hope that helps

ernisj

2009-02-24, 01:27

Hi,

so far from my own experience xbox was better (again, personal opinion!).

Simply because XBMC on xbox was developed for a long time and code was more mature and everything just worked. Also, having weekly builds like T3CH was aweome.

I still like my aTV, but from day one I had numerous problems and still have and some of them are real deal breakers like "sub/idx" type subtitles not working, then having to wait few months for screen calibration issue fix etc.

I understand its all free software and nobody should complain as such, but you've asked which one you think is better...

I believe aTV + XBMC has real potential once all the little things is fixed.

Edit: to answer your question directly, if you already have an xbox I would stick to it for a while - just mod it, costs next to nothing and you can very easily install on/off switch for remote. If possible you can just use ethernet cable instead of wifi and stream content from your PC.

OjNK

2009-02-24, 18:16

I've got both, been using my Xbox for a number of years and loved it but I bought the aTV because the fans were dying and I wanted something with a digital output.

Xbox Pros: VASTLY better remote (Though this will hopefully change in the future as people tweak universal profiles to work with the aTV), quicker release schedule

Cons: Analog output, no HD without an HD pack which is hard to find now if you don't already have one, same with digital audio. Can't be powered on remotely without a hardware hack. Noisy as hell without modification. Sucks a lot of power compared to the apple.

aTV Pros: Digital 720p output over HDMI makes the interface beautiful on a high def TV. Everything is so amazingly crisp, I love it. Its just at fast as the XBox build and with a couple of filter tweaks even SD conent (350mb/hr TV rips) look better.

The aTV uses a lot less power than the xbox, 17W and idle 21W full blast.

The iTunes store is more handy than I expected, the podcast integration is cool (Though doesn't update very quickly), the iTunes rental store is great for movies in a pinch. I use the built in Apple stuff more than I thought I would. Boxee is also available easily (Thoguh thats pretty useless to me in Canada without jumping through VPN hoops, and without Hulu...)

aTV Cons: Crappy 6 button remote (Seriously, this sucks!), doesn't REALLY output high bit rate 720/1080 content (not a big deal for me), doesn't actually turn OFF (that bugs me, though 17W in stand by isn't awful)

Basically I don't think you're really losing out anything with an XBMC/aTV, its about a draw with the pros and cons IMO.

ernisj

2009-02-25, 00:35

Cons: Analog output, no HD without an HD pack which is hard to find now if you don't already have one, same with digital audio. Can't be powered on remotely without a hardware hack. Noisy as hell without modification. Sucks a lot of power compared to the apple.

If original poster will go xbox route, then he can buy cheap $5 HD cables on ebay, I did and it works fine, no need for original cables from MS. Also, installing digital audio output is very easy - just google for it or go to xbox-scene.

My old xbox is very quiet compared to new xbox 360 and I was never leaving it on anyway - if I want to watch something it powers straight into XBMC in seconds. Btw, installing remote on/off took me about 10mins, google for XIR if you are interested.

720p on aTV is a hit and miss, some stuff works and some doesn't. Hopefully in the future devs can improve HD playback, but for some reason I doubt it.

Edit: forgot to add - if you watch a lot of foreign movies or animations or whatever with subtitles, definitely go with xbox, XBMC and Boxee on aTV has issues with "sub/idx" files.

P.S I know, I'm getting annoying with repeating the same thing over and over... :)

OjNK

2009-02-25, 17:10

EVery time I've looked on eBay the only HD cables for the Xbox 1 available were $40+. I'm sure they're available though. Still can't replace HDMI.

I don't consider anything involving hardware modification to be relevant. You can do a lot of things if you crack open the box and get out the soldering iron but I'm talking a device you can plunk in a rack and use with minor software mods.

I haven't watched anything with subs on my aTV yet, I actually didn't know it was an issue until I started seeing that in threads here. That does suck but I'm sure it'll be corrected.

healeydave

2009-02-25, 23:43

Hi all
just wondering if xbox can do what appletv does
ie play movies uploaded in wi-fi from mac computer
question really is
i already have xbox, do I have to get appletv on top of that or is there a way to use xbox to do that, saving big$ in the process...??
thx

I have tried XBMC on AppleTV today and found it to be dreadful, I would recommend sticking to an Xbox (where it originated).

I never used XBMC on an Xbox myself but I know friends that swore by it so I imagine it works much better on the original platform.

My problems trying to use XBMC on an ATV included random reboots when simply using the menu's (not a good start) and I found the cool bits like having IMDB artwork for your material actually useless. A scrape took ages to work through a folder with just 40 titles and it only got 3 right resulting in many of them with inaccurate "jap films" applied to the files :-(

I assume the scraping works by the file names, all of-which were accurate and could be searched on manually using a browser with no trouble finding the correct titles at all!

tyche

2009-02-26, 02:27

OjNK

2009-02-26, 04:33

I have tried XBMC on AppleTV today and found it to be dreadful, I would recommend sticking to an Xbox (where it originated).

I never used XBMC on an Xbox myself but I know friends that swore by it so I imagine it works much better on the original platform.

You imagine, but don't know since you've never used it yourself. Why are you commenting again?

My problems trying to use XBMC on an ATV included random reboots when simply using the menu's (not a good start) and I found the cool bits like having IMDB artwork for your material actually useless. A scrape took ages to work through a folder with just 40 titles and it only got 3 right resulting in many of them with inaccurate "jap films" applied to the files :-(

I assume the scraping works by the file names, all of-which were accurate and could be searched on manually using a browser with no trouble finding the correct titles at all!

I've never found the info scraping to be reliable on ANY version of XBMC, this isn't an aTV flaw. Its an extremely difficult heuristic to do considering the variations in file names and data sources.

As for the reboots thats pretty strange, nothing I've run across on mine. Strange behavior in abnormal situations is just as common on the Xbox though, possibly even moreso.

healeydave

2009-02-26, 09:56

I use xbmc on atv and it's everything I wanted and more. You just can't beat the price for the features. However, I just use it for SD tv content and DVD's I won't assume it's viable for HD content (high bitrate) and considering some of the hardware people use to do that and still have problems, you can't expect much.

I've never had a problem with scraping either and it's quite fast doing so. I've added close to 500 movies and hundreds of tv shows and the only scraping problem I quickly learned to avoid was adding the date on ambiguous movie titles.

Hi Tyche,
Your enthusiastic comments gives me hope, I decided yesterday it was a lost cause and let my atv upgrade to get rid of xbmc before I threw it out the window :-) It was several of the most frustrating hours I've had in a long time.

Just to re-iterate, I had no problems playing content, it was just the bug's causing reboots and the poor scraping that frustrated me.

I would love to know your settings to get reliable graphics, I mean I just used the defaults using the imdb database. There were chick flick (for the missus) with really basic titles like "Atonement" & "27 Dresses" with correct spelling that it failed to identify, it doesn't get any simpler than that and yet it managed to get "Indiana Jones 4 cd-1" correct !?!?

healeydave

2009-02-26, 10:14

You imagine, but don't know since you've never used it yourself. Why are you commenting again?

I'm commenting because I figured something that had been ported to many platforms must have worked better on the preceding ones to have got this far.

I have to admit my negative comments were born out of frustration and in my experience its no bad thing to have negative comments. At least people that have the same problems know its not just them and it helps flaws get fixed (rather than people praise what does work and keep quiet about what doesn't).

I've never found the info scraping to be reliable on ANY version of XBMC, this isn't an aTV flaw. Its an extremely difficult heuristic to do considering the variations in file names and data sources.

That's useful to know, already I can save wasting any more time trying to get movie graphics and just stick to file listings.

As for the reboots thats pretty strange, nothing I've run across on mine. Strange behavior in abnormal situations is just as common on the Xbox though, possibly even more-so.

I have no idea how anyone that has installed xbmc hasn't seen reboots from using the menu's. Its so common I can replicate it within seconds.

All you have to do it navigate through the menu's, notice on some menu's you can move right and the cursor location has moved off where you were but you have no idea where it is. Pressing and holding menu at that point will cause a reboot.

If you know xbmc thoroughly, you might not notice it because you know your navigation, but I found it easy to end up with several reboots yesterday because whilst trying to find out how to do things, I was experimenting with holding down menu all over the place to see if there was another menu I hadn't found.

S80_UK

2009-02-26, 11:23

If you know xbmc thoroughly, you might not notice it because you know your navigation, but I found it easy to end up with several reboots yesterday because whilst trying to find out how to do things, I was experimenting with holding down menu all over the place to see if there was another menu I hadn't found.
I thought I might comment here. I am an ATV noob. I am an XBMC noob. I don't have these crashes. Yes - XBMC on the ATV can crash - but mostly when messing around while streaming rather than just navigating the menus.

It sounds to me as though something may have gone wrong during your installation. From your posts, I am not sure that you will feel like trying again, but a fresh install may be worth trying. And since I am a noob, I don't know if it will make any difference, but I'd also do a restore and update on the ATV first so that I was starting from a known reference point (maybe you did that - I don't know).

healeydave

2009-02-26, 12:36

That's exactly what I did, for clarity:

I did an apple restore on my ATV (back to the original ATV O/S)

I then instructed the ATV to update itself to 2.3

I put in my USB stick created with USB Creator (downloaded only 5 days ago)
(That is the best util, so much easier than when I created my original patchstick :-)

Upon ATV reboot, I went into Launcher, Downloads and installed Launcher 2.3

After that I went back into Launcher Downloads and installed XBMC Atlantis (bf1).

I rebooted into XBMC and my problems started.

Unless I'm missing something, I this makes my setup as nominal & standard as it can possibly be!

healeydave

2009-02-26, 12:46

Update:
I have two AppleTV's, I have just done exactly the same procedure (as my previous post), so a fresh install on a completely different unit.

How to make it crash and reboot in a couple of easy presses:

1. Physically powered off and back on unit. (ATV boots into Apple O/S 2.3
2. Select Launcher, XBMC
3. Press Play to enter Videos
4. Press Play to enter my network storage (a Fuppes Server)
5. Press Play to enter a directory called "video"
(I get my folder listings consisting of ".. , movies , tv shows")
6. I stop navigating and move left which puts me onto "View: full list"
7. press and hold menu

Bang apple logo, reboot into ATV O/S

tyche

2009-02-26, 14:17

basic titles like "Atonement" & "27 Dresses" with correct spelling that it failed to identify, it doesn't get any simpler than that and yet it managed to get "Indiana Jones 4 cd-1" correct !?!?

You should check if you're using folder names instead of filenames for lookups. But I would just get in the habit of appending the date to filenames. Indiana Jones 4 is a 1:1 find while Atonement has multiple results. For example with a file name of "Atonement (2007).avi" imdb gets 1 result. If you still can't get a correct result, I would look at the scraper logs because something is fishy in the config.

As for your crashes, you're best to get a crashreport log, host it on pastebin.com and link it here for the experts to look at. ATV should not be rebooting (obviously) so something isn't right.

S80_UK

2009-02-26, 20:57

How to make it crash and reboot in a couple of easy presses:

1. Physically powered off and back on unit. (ATV boots into Apple O/S 2.3
2. Select Launcher, XBMC
3. Press Play to enter Videos
4. Press Play to enter my network storage (a Fuppes Server)
5. Press Play to enter a directory called "video"
(I get my folder listings consisting of ".. , movies , tv shows")
6. I stop navigating and move left which puts me onto "View: full list"
7. press and hold menu

Bang apple logo, reboot into ATV O/S
OK - I have just tried - I can make it crash like that (never tried a long press in that state before). But you don't have to make it crash like that in order to use and enjoy a very capable piece of software. I have watched probably 50 - 100 hours of DVD rips and other stuff in the past weeks since I got my ATV. Just because you've found a simple way to make it fall over, does not devalue the rest of it in my view.

healeydave

2009-02-26, 20:58

You should check if you're using folder names instead of filenames for lookups. But I would just get in the habit of appending the date to filenames. Indiana Jones 4 is a 1:1 find while Atonement has multiple results. For example with a file name of "Atonement (2007).avi" imdb gets 1 result.

Spent ages looking up movie names on IMDB for their year and renaming all my files.

My storage now matches a perfect hit (with a manual search in a browser).

Cleared the XBMC Library and did a re-scan (YAWN)......

No better, still finds some crap "Trigun" jap movie as a match for multiple files despite running it on a movie directory with completely different one-off movies in it!?!?!?!

Second day its nearly gone out the window, god this systems frustrating, it shouldn't be this hard!!!!!!!!!!

healeydave

2009-02-26, 22:00

I have had a quick look at the logs, I think the scraping part of XBMC is struggling to cope with upnp devices (or at least mine for sure). Its the only explanation as to why other people are able to get any sense out of IMDB scraping at all.

I am scraping files which are resident on a DataRobot running Fuppes. Whilst XBMC is capable of reading the file names ok and even streaming the files ok, it fails dismally when trying to scrape with the results previously noted above.

I think I need to give up on this now, its already knocked a couple of years off my life expectancy through stress :-(

TeknoJnky

2009-02-26, 22:09

healeydave

2009-02-26, 22:24

maybe you should set your sources directly to the file folders instead of trying to streaming them over upnp.

I've always assumed that the scraping was intended for locally or smb network shares, not UPNP.

AAAAARRRRRGGGGGHHHHHHHH..........

It was UPNP, I just added the the drive directly as an IP address and it looks like its working, its going a lot faster too.

Whilst I'm happy to get a resolution to one problem, I can't help feeling a lot of stress could have been avoided if it was clear at the outset that Scraping is not compatible with upnp devices :-(

TeknoJnky

2009-02-26, 22:40

Glad its working better for you now.

While I agree there is no clear indication what the scrapers can/can't scrape, I would expect that most users would not try to scrape or apply metadata to something like upnp (which is generally better suited as a dynamic solution rather than a more static one where you can access/play the files directly).

The shortest route between 2 points is a straight line, you don't need to go through the fuppes at all as xbmc should be to play nearly any common file type directly.