View Full Version : A "thin" XBMC-installation
Hello,
I'm planning on building a thin XMBC-computer. With "thin", I mean with some kind of (small) Solid State Disk (SSD) for the operating system (probably Windows XP stripped-to-the-bone) and all media on storage over Gigabit Ethernet to a some kind of NAS device (tips gratefully accepted :-) ).
Do anyone have a installation like this? Is Gigabit Ethernet fast enough to playback HD-material?
I imagine this solution would be quite nice (if it works) as the HTPC itself could be very small and slim (m-ATX or even mini-ITX). No hard drives => silent. The NAS device could be stuffed away somewhere (wardrobe? ;-) ).
What say you?
yes gigabit is fast enough, heck regular 100mbit lan is fine. I use a ssd with vista 32bit (org planned to use xp sp3, but i found vista better with my gpu for anti-tearing)
DG45FC x4500 HDMI Media mITX mobo
Intel e8600 CPU
HIPER HFC-10828-C2 ultra-slim heatsink
Patriot 64gb 2.5'' warp SSD
4gb of Kingston pc6400 RAM
120watt PicoPSU
Aopen S120 mITX case (cheap, tiny, and very nice piano black finish)
Logitech Harmony One Remote + USB-UIRT to control everything
firewuff
2008-12-22, 04:31
yes gigabit is fast enough, heck regular 100mbit lan is fine. I use a ssd with vista 32bit (org planned to use xp sp3, but i found vista better with my gpu for anti-tearing)
THe thing to watch with the NAS boxes is not your network speed, you can stream HD over 11G (54Mb/s... Blu-Ray tops out around 40Mb/s) wireless on a good connection (not reliabily). It's depends more on the NAS box'es speed. I've got a Thescus 2100 which isn't bad and had no problems streaming from it but some of the older ones won't keep up.
BTW SSD's arn't all that "thin". Their average power requirments are higher (peak power is lower when compared to a spinning up HDD) and speed is better but not a concern for this application, the also run a lot hotter. I'd stick with a 5400rpm drive for price and power and heat unless this is going in a car or on a trampoline (hehehe...pimp my play set). With 2+ GB of ram you wont notice the difference in performance (except on boot) as your not using the disk in any case.
BRETT
Snowflake
2008-12-22, 06:14
I'm running a system like you specify, although i'm running XBMC Live so i'm linux based. Total install is on an 8G USB key, all media streamed from a Promise NS4300N storage array.
The only thing I don't really like is that I have to use SMB (Samba, ie. windows networking) for the connection to the NAS, when i'd prefer to use NFS (which is oodles faster between a Linux-based storage array and a Linux-based xbmc.
Still, no problems yet at 720p. Haven't tried any 1080p yet.
Thank you for your inputs!
I didn't know about the heat and power demands on SSD disks, might aswell go for a 5400 RPM instead. The USB-installation sounded interesting though... I've heard that a USB flash memory gets worn down if there's a lot of write operations to it (as it will be if I use it as storage for the OS). Is this true?
The Thecus 2100 seems good, the Promise device might be a little to expensive for me. I guess you're running the HDDs mirrored on the Thecus? I would love to have a NAS device with support for atleast three disks (read RAID-5), but it might be tough with my budget.
ZTOctavian
2008-12-28, 00:50
For your NAS try this its what I use and is great!
http://www.raidsonic.de/en/pages/products/external_cases.php?we_objectID=5052
Takes 2 SATA II drives and is gigabit aswell very quiet just one small fan in back and under load take up only <19 watts.
http://www.overclockers.co.uk/showproduct.php?prodid=HD-029-BT
Nick
Even though it's gigabit, it only has an throughput of ~7-8 MB/s (56-64Mb/s). Gigabit has the theoretical potential of 125 MB/s. This issue is shared among almost all consumer NAS-devices.
For your NAS try this its what I use and is great!
http://www.raidsonic.de/en/pages/products/external_cases.php?we_objectID=5052
Takes 2 SATA II drives and is gigabit aswell very quiet just one small fan in back and under load take up only <19 watts.
http://www.overclockers.co.uk/showproduct.php?prodid=HD-029-BT
Nick
ZTOctavian
2008-12-28, 01:37
This is true! :rolleyes: damn marketing folk :;):
DWolf how the hell have you that PSU wired to that board?
I just looked up the board it has the 2 x 12 main connector?
ah... just saw the pico! :laugh:
:sad: I didnt get any PicoPSU in any christmas crackers this year!
Which exact picoPSU and transformer are you using?
Cheers,
Nick.
Which exact picoPSU and transformer are you using?
PicoPSU 120W DC-DC + PW12-8.5A AC-DC (110W),
Also using a Molex to 4-Pin P4 12V power adapter
btw, ssd's run cool, at least mine does, barely even anything remotely warm to the touch; I also bought for the fact its completely silent. (the faster performance is just an added bonus)
it would be nice if you can use windows xp embedded to install xbmc ...unsure of even where to get the license or even to buy it???
I use FreeNAS on a dual core Intel CPU. FreeNAS will install on much, much older machines than I use.
It is documented that FreeNAS, built on FreeBSD has slow Samba output. The fix is using the embedded install and speed is great. Best of all it is free.
Kryspy
ZTOctavian
2008-12-29, 01:38
Well Junk!
Just found a nice case too! prolly one Ill go for:
http://www.apextechusa.com/products.asp?pID=179
Its the MI-100BK by Apex.
Pros:
It has an imbedded 250watt PSU.
It has a port incase a future mini-ITX mobo you wish to use has PCI-E x16.
Small with glossy black finish - looks nice!
Cheap cheap cheap!
Regards,
Nick.
Thank you for all tips! Will definitely look into them!
ZTOctavian, do you have the case, or are you (as me) planning on buying?
ZTOctavian
2008-12-29, 03:39
hey dwolf!
Hi Junk,
Planning.... case seems difficult to get!? no longer supported by aopen.
Sorry to hijack your thread but you made need this info anyways!
@ DWOLF
Would this bee the stuff?
http://www.mini-itx.com/store/default.asp?c=10#ac110
Top of the page link ---> picoPSU-120 12V DC-DC ATX PSU
+
Further down ----> 110W AC Universal Adapter 12V 9A
Have you got any where else to get these their bloody expensive!!!! :sad:
Thanks again,
Nick.
nugentgl
2008-12-29, 11:31
HFX in Austria? sells similar PSU's to the PICO PSU. Might be cheaper if you live in Europe.
ZTOctavian
2009-01-06, 00:10
Thanks Nugentgl
This is making for some interesting reading guys!
http://www.avsforum.com/avs-vb/showthread.php?t=1050640&page=21
SSD on Windows
2 things
1. turn off indexing
2. do not run defrag never again
Do not worry about what people say about SSD wearing. They do but not as much as they once did.
What can do a lot of damage and wear then down is defragging and indexing.
Those two activies create a lot of extra writes for a drive, and SSD do not need that.
wierd0n3
2009-01-06, 03:18
SSD on Windows
2 things
1. turn off indexing
2. do not run defrag never again
Do not worry about what people say about SSD wearing. They do but not as much as they once did.
What can do a lot of damage and wear then down is defragging and indexing.
Those two activies create a lot of extra writes for a drive, and SSD do not need that.
I would Personally add to this and say make sure you have 2 GB ram and turn off your swap file. I don't use a swap on my tv-pc and haven't seen any bad points.
Defrag isnt all that bad, used properly. use it once after you have finished setting up the install, after that, remove the shortcut in accessories.
if you feel particularly ambitious, set a ram drive up and point your TEMP directories to it.
I remember a group making a XP live-CD, and they had all needed write operations go to a ram drive.
There are a few other "build it yourself" options regarding storage. I'm using OpenFiler (http://www.openfiler.com/) which is similar to Kryspy's suggestion. It will support a number of different file systems like iSCSI, NFS, SMB/CIFS, HTTP/WebDAV and FTP.
You can also take a look at http://lime-technology.com/ as they have an interesting RAID solution that looks to make the maximum use of disks while still providing parity. From what I understand, you can use disks of different sizes AND add to it as you grow your storage needs without destroying the array.
They have a free demo (http://lime-technology.com/wordpress/?page_id=46) that boots from a USB key and will allow you to create a 3 disk array. The paid version is VERY affordable at $119 to protect a 16 drive array and this is something I'll probably look at later, not had chance to look yet.
There are LOTS of options for storage!
I second the unRAID solution. I have a pair of them and over 7TB opf space with plenty of room to grow. Bang for the buck this is a great way to go but write speeds are a little slow unless a cache drive is used which I'm not doing...
ZTOctavian
2009-01-06, 15:50
Yes the OCZ units got some bad press but SSD is in early stages for anyone building a small unit be prepared for tweaks and workarounds to get the most from a small HTPC build.