View Full Version : Font Sizing
skunkm0nkee
2008-09-24, 13:03
One of the main complaints (or at least one of the most common anyway) is that some text is not big enough to see could we make it bigger. We've added new font sets (Bigger for 4x3 and Bigger or Massive for non-4x3) to try and alleviate the problem and thankfully these do seem to work for a number of users but there still seems to be a few users out there who are still struggling.
We can't just increase font sizes across the board as it would just mess up certain parts of the skin (where the area the text resides is not big enough to accommodate large fonts) so we've added increases to the fonts that we think would be most needed.
I'm starting this thread so that if there are any users out there that have tried the Bigger (and Massive if non 4x3) font sets and they still need further changes then they can detail them here.
To request a change please detail which resolution you are running in, which font set you are using and then details of the text size that needs changing (detailed screen and text info or a screenshot if possible) and we'll see what we can do
THANKS!!
I have upgraded to .92 and the fonts work great for me...
I will examine closer to see if any fields are over crowded or what not...
Now we just need icons for "up a level" and this will make navigation easier. I noticed the request for a GUI button...that may be nice too for noobs or women. haha (mine would kill me if she read that)
Thanks again...Wonderful Skin.
I have gotten multiple people interested in the XBMC project as a whole now that it runs on multiple platforms and this awesome skin.
Whatgift
2008-09-27, 02:34
I'm using 0.92 on my Xbox, and changing the font setting has no effect on the font size, making the list screens (which I use mostly) difficult to read.
Is there something I'm missing here?
funkytown
2008-09-27, 03:15
Second that, no difference in font readability on xbox attached to 32" 16:9 CRT, whether i choose massive or bigger.
I had to bump up the size of each font type manually by 5 in font.xml to be able to use mediastream without having do digg my googles out of the basement.
skunkm0nkee
2008-09-29, 01:00
As I said above:
To request a change please detail which resolution you are running in, which font set you are using and then details of the text size that needs changing (detailed screen and text info or a screenshot if possible) and we'll see what we can do
Cocophone
2008-09-30, 08:33
I'm using v93 and I still get no difference in font sizes between default, bigger, and massive.
My resolution on my xbox is 4:3 NTSC
Too small of fonts for my aging eyesight.
skunkm0nkee
2008-09-30, 10:00
As far asI remember you won't see any difference on the settings screens but the plot info's for episodes/movies etc should definitely be affected by the font set you select
I am using the latesst T3CH build of XBMC, plus the latest MediaStream Skin on a 27" 4:3 NTSC tv, and the font's are still really hard to read throughout the entire skin, especially the plot/season info. I took a bunch of screenshots, but excuse my ignorance i dont know where/how to upload them. I have tried the massive and bigger fonts, rebooting after each change but nothing has helped.
If you want screenshots, i can provide them....sigh i just need some instructions where i can upload them. Fawk sound like a damn newbie hahaha
Cheers!
wyild1
If you could up some of your screenshots to the likes of www.imageshack.us (http://www.imageshack.us) that would be perfect then paste the links in here and we can have a proper look at the issue.
D
rwparris2
2008-10-02, 18:49
They were really small for me too so I went through font.xml and increased everything +5 as another thread on the MediaStream forum suggested.
There are some overlap issues but I barely pay attention to them, the benefit of being able to read is worth it IMO.
X3lectric
2008-10-02, 20:11
Right Font issues and screenshots I dont see unless you using the same harware that anyscreenshots are gonna help at all because you will be seing how it shows on your screen not mine or anyother joe user
So I'm posting one screenshot and the rest Pics of the screen with a 5megapixel camera which is as close as you get to the real deal unless your sitting in front of my own TV or anyone elses....
http://tinyurl.com/4xv4vj
The perfect screenshot shows the rss TXT against backround its hardly visible and thats a perfect screenshot
The other two are cropped pictures that I took of the screen on the TV for some bizzare reason the white comes out whiter than it actually shows and although unreadable on the pictures its very clear on screen but you get a good enough idea about the other skin txt which remains same size regardless of what size I choose on skin which is the version released XBMC t3ch beta1 Atlantis
Issues are context menu and obviously selected text and general contrast of the font against select/non selected generaly I have trouble reading it seating on the sofa two meters away.
Same with general fonts on skin which are narrow and dont forget here unlike most people perhaps, for instance my eyesight since birth cannot be corrected 100% which mean I see but 70%~80% of what normal people see if you make a general skinfont for all menus like that on some normal Tv's and from a distance coupled with eyesight issues and it's no longer a problem of being able to reproduce it on your set ups....
Hopefully you'll get a general idea of what so many ppl are moaning about but all I have to say is where theres smoke theres fire... worth playing with a different font altogether? Its up to you...
As a old sk00l Gfx Designer that is used to tampography, serigraphy and other odd things and mostly working with massive plotters and coreldraw for advertising/vinyl cutting Logo design etc, that got started with Photoshop only less than 3 years ago I have to say Painting whatever on 10 metersx7 Meters wall and using Photoshop for gfx design on the web its a great difference and the audience is harder to please because the canvases e.g. TV/LCD/CRT screens that display one single picture take on so many different sizes and shapes and are better and worst quality than your own... a wall is just one wall and and even diffrent walls the result is the same because the canvas remains constant.
I doubt Mikebeecham would ever want to but if you ever need someone to play with Photoshop and pitch in other ideas you know where to find me...
On another note Its a great looking skin nice concept and with a much better potential as well as true originality than some other skins that well are just well mastered great rips offs... In the end a fake is a fake and the original is worth way more...
Morning
Here are a few screenshots
http://img508.imageshack.us/my.php?image=screenshot000ab9.png
http://img211.imageshack.us/my.php?image=screenshot001jk8.png
http://img175.imageshack.us/my.php?image=screenshot009bb0.png
http://img206.imageshack.us/my.php?image=screenshot010kj1.png
http://img206.imageshack.us/my.php?image=screenshot004dy6.png
Hope this helpes!
Cheers!
omontero
2008-10-09, 05:55
I agree with X3lectric. This skin is awesome but the fonts problems made very hard to apreciate it in its full glory.
Don't get me wrong I love your effort to make this skin wprk on 4:3 Tv sets like mine but still fonts are too small and things really are hard to read.
Anyway Ill keep testing the new releases of this skin until I get one with a font I can read. I really love this skins and want to use it 24/7 on my xbox.
Issues are context menu and obviously selected text and general contrast of the font against select/non selected generaly I have trouble reading it seating on the sofa two meters away.
Yea I agree, I didn't know if anyone else was seeing this, but I made a thread and got no response: http://xbmc.org/forum/showthread.php?t=37576
It'd be nice to know where the team is headed with respect to these issues. At least some reassurance (or not :P) that these issues are being worked on.
Guys please bear with us we are looking into the font issues and looking at the possibly of including a second alternative font.
D
skunkm0nkee
2008-10-09, 13:30
It's something we're looking into but we're pretty much doing it off our own back as we still haven't had any real specific feedback that we can act on. I had been hoping that some of the users who have complained about the font sizing could have spent a few minutes to detail where the fonts are too small.
For example - I'm running in 720p with Massive font but Plot summary in Episodes view is not big enough.
That is information we can act on, but just saying the fonts aren't big enough is pretty much useless to us.
JustMeD and skunkm0nkee thanks for the responses.
To everyone else, lets be more specific with feedback! ;)
Regarding the thread that I posted about the current selection not being easy to see: http://xbmc.org/forum/showthread.php?t=37576, any thoughts on that? I think X3lectric also agrees, especially when looking at a distance.
skunkm0nkee
2008-10-09, 20:48
The main issue is that people want transparency to see the backgrounds and the more background you see the more chance that some backgrounds can interfere with the text. Hopefully the focused item is always more visible?
The main issue is that people want transparency to see the backgrounds and the more background you see the more chance that some backgrounds can interfere with the text. Hopefully the focused item is always more visible?
In the screenshot that I took the other day, the current selection is nicely visible but the rest isn't:
http://img369.imageshack.us/img369/5374/textmediastreamyk8on7.jpg
What if you were to keep the opacity of the backgrounds fixed but incresed the opacity of the text:?
http://img363.imageshack.us/img363/6125/textmedia1outlinedmockuqi9.jpg
In this case the text legibility would be much better while preserving the translucency of the background.
Also the other issue we are having is that in some cases the current selection is not easy to see (especially when looking at XBMC from the couch ;) ):
http://img223.imageshack.us/img223/7146/currentselectionissuesnv3.jpg
I'm sorry if I'm placing too much emphasis on the screenshots; I just wanted them to be clear so that there isn't any misunderstanding.
skunkm0nkee
2008-10-10, 00:03
Not really a font sizing issue but I agree with you, will have a think about how to make that easier to track
I'm sorry if I'm placing too much emphasis on the screenshots; I just wanted them to be clear so that there isn't any misunderstanding.
Not at all, screenshots are great and a clear and concise description of the problem is very useful. Thanks
skunkm0nkee
2008-10-10, 17:02
In the screenshot that I took the other day, the current selection is nicely visible but the rest isn't:
http://img369.imageshack.us/img369/5374/textmediastreamyk8on7.jpg
Also the other issue we are having is that in some cases the current selection is not easy to see (especially when looking at XBMC from the couch ;) ):
http://img223.imageshack.us/img223/7146/currentselectionissuesnv3.jpg
Both those issues should now have been addressed for the next release.
Additionally we've done some experimenting with a new default font which will (hopefully) be easier to read on screen.
http://img296.imageshack.us/img296/2674/videoinfodq9.png
Nice! Does the fix apply to just info windows, or also elsewhere? I'd be great if it applied also elsewhere. It's looking great, thanks for the prompt fix, I didn't think the change would come that soon :)
BTW I love the kind of selection used on the onscreen keyboard. Apart from the nice contrast, the glowing animation is pretty cool.
Morning
Here are a few screenshots
http://img508.imageshack.us/my.php?image=screenshot000ab9.png
http://img211.imageshack.us/my.php?image=screenshot001jk8.png
http://img175.imageshack.us/my.php?image=screenshot009bb0.png
http://img206.imageshack.us/my.php?image=screenshot010kj1.png
http://img206.imageshack.us/my.php?image=screenshot004dy6.png
Hope this helpes!
Cheers!
On those screenshots the font looks very narrow, what kind of resolution and display are you using?
On my machine the font looks different, it's not narrow. I did notice that sometimes if a different resolution is chosen on the settings the font can look narrow. Maybe you just need to adjust the resolution?
On those screenshots the font looks very narrow, what kind of resolution and display are you using?
On my machine the font looks different, it's not narrow. I did notice that sometimes if a different resolution is chosen on the settings the font can look narrow. Maybe you just need to adjust the resolution?
Those are off my xbox, so....whatever the xbox default resolution is set to is the size of those pics. I agree a different res prob would help but its not possible on an xbox (correct me if im wrong!)
Cheers!
neoanderson2002
2008-10-14, 09:24
Hi Razorfish team,
I recently upgraded to v0.95 and I like the changes!
I am using output of 1024x768 resolution on a 32" NTSC Tube TV, bigger font selected. The menu items are the right size for legibility and fitting in the skin. I have just a tiny suggestion. I am mostly using videos in file mode using Cover Flow for video sources and Animated Media Preview view for videos. A slight +5 font size in Animated Media Preview would be great for the video file names. Also, when displaying the video OSD, a +5 font size to the video file name would be great as well. I've manually made these changes to font.xml and they look better to me.
Everything else for me seems to be addressed already! Keep up the great work!
Cheers,
-Neo
Just installed the new skin and the text is a bit more readable. Im at work so i dont have screen shots, but i aggree with neoanderson2002. The font size needs, IMO, to be just slightly bigger. i dunno about +5 cuz i think with my xbox that would cause a bit more scrolling, but +5 could work
Keep up the awesome work! Digging the skin :)
Cheers!
super_sobbie
2008-10-21, 18:39
First let me say GREAT SKIN!!! I do love this on my ubuntu box. the quality is unbelievable. I would not change a thing if all I was using it on was a 22" monitor with ubuntu. The problem that I see is when I try to use it on my 36" TV. no it is not a highdef tv. nope not lcd or plasma... just a plain old 36" TV that I got around 5 years ago. Almost all the text is small and fuzzy. very fuzzy, and since the tv does not picture a crisp clear letter it makes it almost impossible to read. Does the team test this skin on a regular TV or only monitors and HDTVs?
So my problem is with all the plot previews, and the settings section. I can not see them unless I get up and move within 5 feet of the TV. And even then the text is fuzzy. I do not have screenshots since I am at work but I will try to get them later tonight. I Love this skin and will still be using it (probably with one of the modes for just cover art since I can not read plots anyways) for a long time. I will also play with the +5 font that was mentioned through this skin.
Thanks again for all the hard work on this skin. it does look amazing and I do appreciate everything that the team has done.
SoBBie
The new font sizing appeared in Mediastream 0.95 is a great job, that users with some screen problems were waiting for.
Congratulations!
But would it be possible to add a new third option to the current skin font settings (Configure > Appearance > Skin Fonts > Bigger/Massive) that could be named Narrow, to restore the previous font and its narrowed sizing?
(that people with no problem of screen readability could take benefit from)
=> as other posts said: of course some current English text are now overlapping
=> but, even worse: most of the localizations include slightly longer texts when translating English, and then the "bad" overlapping effects are far more present.
Then I would really find useful to get this suggested new Skin Font settings called Narrow, enabling to restore the previous font sizing for screen that can support it.
Thanx to all of you, Mediastream is a great job...
We just want to reach the prefect!
Hallelujah!
My previous wish of adding the "old" narrowed font (before Mediastream 0.95) available in the skin settings has made come true:
=> version O.96.5 proposes several alternative fonts to the (new) "Default" one, including "Alt Default" which is exactly the "old" narrowed one... :)