View Full Version : Movies beginning with "The"
I've used many past T3CH builds of XBMC. I loaded up the most recent 2008-09-01 build and it works great for the most part. I do notice now that all my movies that start with "The" such as "The Queen" are now listed down in the T section when sorted alphabetically. Past version of T3CH's build didn't do this and I would like to be able to change it back to what I'm used to. I looked through the settings but didn't see an option to ignore "The" while sorting.
Is there any way to fix this? I also noticed that it still ignores "The" while in Library Mode.
Thanks in advance.
ShortySco
2008-09-10, 04:57
I think the option you are looking for is Appearence/View options/Ignore Tokens when sorting.
I think you can add extra tokens too, with the advanced settings.xml (ie. for "A nightmare on Elm St", for example)
Shorty
Thanks for the helpful reply. I added the advancedsettings.xml file and am still having trouble. This is the body of advancedsettings.xml.
<advancedsettings>
<sorttokens>
<token>the</token>
<token>The</token>
</sorttokens>
</advancedsettings>
With that file and no matter if I turn the "Ignore tokens when sorting" option on or off it doesn't seem to make a difference.
ShortySco
2008-09-10, 06:42
hmmm... i'm not sure... sorry.
With the option enabled "The" is filtered without the advanced settings, it's for adding others (Dunno if any others are by default or not)
All i can really add, is that this works for me in library mode, but not files (I assume this is meant to be?)
Shorty
Yes this is exactly the same for me. Work in Library mode but not in Files View. This is a fairly recent change though and I hold out hope there is a way to get the old sort order back.
not in file view, its a file view. a view of your files
Sorry I know I'm not the best at explaining this. What I mean is while in the video section of XBMC listing my video while not in library mode.
Same problem here. In some skins it did'nt work, but now even when I use "Project Mayhem III" it will not work anymore. I tried every setting and different skins.
The "Ignore The" seems to do nothing.
Standard, I use the "Basic-Vision" skin.
What I mean is while in the video section of XBMC listing my video while not in library mode.Not in Library Mode = File View.
See Spiff's answer.
mgboom, same goes for you then.
Sho, I know what you mean. But in previous versions it worked, so why was it removed? Some people don't want to use the library mode. I personally hate it, because its very slow if you have a lot of files.
Presumably because a decision was made to have the files view a... uhm... files view.
That is not my experience, what do you call "a lot of files"?
Around 2000 that actually exist.
Another annoyance; To clean to library, I have to rebuild it every somewhat months, because I sometimes replace files (Cleaning the database through the settings/movie dialog doesn't work that well).
MyVideos34.db = 12Mb. So it's presumably time to rebuild it again.
But I would simply prefer to use the File View, I don't need all the overload in library mode.
Pr.Sinister
2008-09-14, 03:20
I too was disappointed to find that the recent builds couldn't ignore "The" in
file mode.
Library is all fine and dandy for people who don't suffer from OCD or are extremely
anal like myself.
I like my Library to be perfect so my "Downloads" folder isn't part of it. I do not
have time to cleanup my Downloads folder to move contents to their proper
place as soon as they are downloaded. I do it once a week or even once a month. So i use file mode to watch yesterday's episode of "The Cleaner" or
"The Shield". The 1st one used to be under the C's and the second under the S's.
I do not want to have to scan a filename that is not in it's proper place and that
is not named the way i like it. I personally cannot stand to have files in
my extensive library that are named
"The.Shield.S07E01.REPACK.DSR.XviD-0TV.[VTV].avi"
I rename those when i have time and they are then moved to the proper
drive :
The Shield-(7x01)-Coefficient of Drag.avi
What's annoying is that before library mode, i used to name my movie folders
in this way :
Bourne Ultimatum, The (2007)
But the IMDB scraper wouldn't always find movies named this way. Then i
found the wonderful option of ignoring "The" so i renamed all my folders to
the proper way. Now, it is gone from filemode.
I am trying to find a way to use Library mode all the time but it isn't easy
to do because i download a lot of stuff every day and simply cannot spend
all my free time preparing files to be imported into the library. I already am
way behind in importing my current 7 TB of Movies and TV Shows but when
i figure out the best way, i will let all the other OCD sufferers know :)
P.S. This is by no means a rant/flame. Just explaining one of the many reasons
why many people are not in Library mode 24/7.
-Pr.
I noticed on build 15201 that my movies (which are in a multipath by the way) were not being sorted correctly. Rather, all the "The .." movies were clumped together despite my having "Ignore tokens when sorting" switched on. I turned that setting off, no change. Back on, no change.
So, I rebuilt to 15551, just to be sure. The problem is still there.
I had an old build 14430 lying around. That one does NOT have the problem.
Did this just get forgotten? Am I the only one? I'll post a log file if anyone wants, but this doesn't seem to be that kind of problem...
Thanks,
-Dan
it now only applies to library view
Okay, at least it's known. Is it on purpose? And can we put it back the other way?
-Dan
jmarshall
2008-09-15, 04:38
It was removed (intentionally) in r14587. I'm not sure if there was a reason other than it wasn't wanted.
I shall attempt to find out.
Cheers,
Jonathan
Sinister, you said it better then I did.
Anyone know if there is a way to get the feature back?
i disabled that. it was never intended to be there. but i really dont care either way provided there is consistency between music and videos (which there is now.)
Kraqh3d,
If it is only file mode, the group option shoud not be there also. But I know for sure, most people are very happy with it.
Can you put the "Ignore The" option back in maybe all file views (Videos, Music and maybe also Pictures), or a way to do this through an advanced setting in a xml file?
If you would consider it I would be very very very grateful.
mtjerneld
2008-10-16, 14:36
Hi!
I cannot get the feature "Ignore tokens when sorting" to work in the Atlantis betas. I have tried Beta1 on Xbox and Beta2 in Windows with the same result. (Ie. "The Simpsons" will sort below "Something about Mary")
The token I want to exclude from my movielists is "The". I've made sure the <sorttokens> info is present in Advancedsettings.xml and langinfo.xml.
This feature worked fine in older XBMC-versions on my xbox.
Am I missing something here?
it only works in library mode now.
it only works in library mode now.
It also only works for movies i have found, TV series names do NOT ignore the token.
mtjerneld
2008-10-16, 20:49
it only works in library mode now.
Ok, I guess someone thought that was a good idea, but for me it's not. My file structure is very organized and I don't really want to rescan 50+GB of content over wlan every time I upgrade xbmc... But sure, I'll give library mode another go. I just know that I've had this functionality since forever? It could perhaps be made as an option in a future release; "ignore tokens in library" / "ignore tokens in file listings" as separate options?
It also only works for movies i have found, TV series names do NOT ignore the token.
I can't get it to work under movies, any special setting that need to be applied on the folder? I have set content to movies (IMDB).
mtjerneld
2008-10-16, 20:57
Ok, at least I seem to be able to export music/video libraries now, that's cool! Allright, I'll give library mode a serious run, but would still like to see token ignore functionality in folder views.
althekiller
2008-10-16, 21:00
My file structure is very organized and I don't really want to rescan 50+GB of content over wlan every time I upgrade xbmc...
No one is stopping you from backing up or redirecting your userdata folder to avoid rescanning.
How long can 50+GB possibly take? 1.2+TB only takes like 10hrs. :p
for the record, I would like tho see this option back under file view as well. Many people use this and I would think it is not a lot of effort to put it back. correct me if I am out of line or wrong. Personally, I never liked library mode, but with the ability to flatten my movies directory and the xbmc media companion to hand tweak .nfo files, I am giving it another try. It is superior but I always had issues with the scraper (incorrect movies, movies not found etc). with the .nfo files, I can control a lot of that. It is more work but worth it in my opinion.
It could perhaps be made as an option in a future release; "ignore tokens in library" / "ignore tokens in file listings" as separate options?
I agree with this statement 100%...I absolutely hate the fact that someone decided that token ignoring should be removed from file view...Library mode is messy and annoying. File mode is clean and easy to understand an organize.
I hope this function is put back the old way. I used it and don't use library mode.
I wholeheartedly agree with mcowher. I don't use Library Mode because it simply takes too long to scan. I really want the "Ignore Tokens" option back in File view mode. IMO, that would make it more consistent. If you don't want that you turn the option off. If you do, you turn it on. Making it the same in File View and Library View is better.
In all Windows builds I've tried, the "ignore tokens" for sorting does not seem to work (at least not in file view, which I always use). Hence, all movies beginning with "The" are grouped together under "T".
I would have put this down to being a quirk of file view, but XBMC on Xbox always ignored the tokens correctly in file view.
jmarshall
2008-10-29, 10:19
That's intentional. It was deliberately changed so that it doesn't affect files view.
That's intentional. It was deliberately changed so that it doesn't affect files view.
Ok, makes sense why this was happening now thanks.
(I'd started a new post elsewhere, so my prior post was moved here - just in case anyone already posting in this thread was wondering why I can't read everyone else's posts!)
However, I too would like to voice support for bringing back "ignore tokens" to file view. I can see the logic for file view being the true alphabetical order of files, as opposed to titles, though I would have thought any files in the "movies" section would be named according to the movie title.
The reason I do not like library mode is because I have different folders of movies on the network and I wish to browse by folder - eg, if I want to see just movies I've recently added, I just browse to the folder that I store recently added movies, or if I want to browse just HD movies, I browse to the folder that contains my HD movies. To me at least, it's an easier was to navigate in that I can pass the remote to anyone and they will know exactly what they are looking it.
That's intentional. It was deliberately changed so that it doesn't affect files view.
Ok so now we know it was intentional, but many of us simply do not like this change. Was anyone asked their opinion before the change was forced on us?
There are many of us that simply don't want to use Library mode. I too like to organize my movies by folder. I have folders for "New Releases", Kids, Holidays, TV, James Bond, Star Trek, Educational, etc.
I like having complete control of how I organize my movies.
Now, when I use my preferred way of organizing the movies are sorted without regard to tokens like "The"...
Can't we just make this a separate option along the lines of "Ignore Tokens in File View"?
jmarshall
2008-10-29, 23:30
You are welcome to change it yourself if you wish.
It will not be changed back for Atlantis.
You are welcome to change it yourself if you wish.
It will not be changed back for Atlantis.
Is it as simple as changing properties / a flag in specific file(s) that any of us could do manually? If it's something us non-devs could do (and of course, not be fully supported) please let us know. If not, guess we haven't got much choice but to wait post Atlantis and hope there's enough support to get it changed back...
jmarshall
2008-10-30, 01:49
Yes, it's an easy change. See GUIViewStateVideo.cpp
Compare the Files section with the Nav section - basically you use SORT_BY_LABEL_NO_THE when appropriate instead of SORT_BY_LABEL etc.
Excellent - will give it a go on the weekend, thanks.
Yes, it's an easy change. See GUIViewStateVideo.cpp
Compare the Files section with the Nav section - basically you use SORT_BY_LABEL_NO_THE when appropriate instead of SORT_BY_LABEL etc.
And of course after this, compile a new version for your platform....
ps. I'm also puzzled why this behaviour was changed, rendering it inconsistent with how it works in library mode....
again, as kraqh3d has ALREADY stated;
this used to be inconsistent across file views. i personally think it is just as it should be now. if you want your files sorted in a different order, rename them!
when i list my files i dont want the application to feck around with the list at all.
listing movies or shows however, is a different matter.
Without getting into the ins and outs of whether 'Ignore Tokens' should work in file mode, the simple fact is, it doesnt.
My four year old cant understand how to use 'libray mode' and cant understand why his favourite movie 'The Ant Bully' is not first in the list.
I know I'm a terrible parent, but I'm sick of being dragged out of bed at 5:30, whereas he used to be able to start the movie himself and let me sleep.
I've spent alot of time getting TortoiseSVN, visual studio installed, the XBOX SDK and all the files but can't work out for the life of me how to change 'GUIViewStateVideo.cpp' to make it go back to how it used to work. Can someone give me some pointers of how to do this?
I'm all for people helping themselves - and there is enough information out there that I'm sure I'll be able to work out how to recompile, but becomming a proficient C# or C++ (or whatever it is) programmer is beyond my skill set.
Any help would be really appreciated.
keithskaggs
2008-11-02, 17:02
This worked for me but I haven't fully tested it. I just checked one of my sorted directories in file mode and "The" was ignored properly. I believe this disables "The" even if you turn off "Ignore Tokens". I prefer to always ignore "The" no matter what mode I'm in. So any way, here is my inelegant solution.
In the file 'GUIViewStateVideo.cpp', open with notepad and replace all occurannces of '(SORT_METHOD_LABEL,' with '(SORT_METHOD_LABEL_IGNORE_THE,' and then recompile.
Keith
"I'm not a programmer but I did sleep at a Holiday Inn Express last night!"
Cheers Keith!
Tried that and it worked - now I've gone on one step further...Changing the line:
AddSortMethod(SORT_METHOD_LABEL, 551, LABEL_MASKS("%L", "%I", "%L", "")); // FileName, Size | Foldername, empty
to:
if (g_guiSettings.GetBool("filelists.ignorethewhensorting"))
AddSortMethod(SORT_METHOD_LABEL_IGNORE_THE, 551, LABEL_MASKS("%L", "%I", "%L", "")); // FileName, Size | Foldername, empty
else
AddSortMethod(SORT_METHOD_LABEL, 551, LABEL_MASKS("%L", "%I", "%L", "")); // FileName, Size | Foldername, empty
And it links the sorting back to the 'Ignore tokens when sorting' setting.
One thing I dont understand about this change in the first place, in file mode I have the option to sort by 'Name', 'Size', 'Date' & 'File'. It makes perfect sence to me that the sort by 'Name' option takes account of the 'Ignore tokens when sorting' setting. If you want the files listed exactly as they are, use the sort by 'File' setting.
The way it is now in the latest builds, I cant see any differnece between the sort by 'Name' option and the sort by 'File' option. Is there a difference?
Glen
keithskaggs
2008-11-02, 19:14
It did not work for me. But that's OK. I'm quite happy to never have "The" used for sorting. I'll stick with the way I did it, I'm just too lazy to try and decipher the If then Else statements.
How great is it that even a non programmer can customize changes to create our own custom version of such a great piece of software?
Keith
Yep, no doubt about it, it is a great piece of software. Support is second to none - within a couple of hours we have a customised version that sorts our own particular needs exactly.
At work we have software that we pay £50K a year in support costs, ontop of what it cost in the first place, and it cant hold a candle to this.
jmarshall
2008-11-02, 21:51
Honestly - it's a files view. If you want them to sort differently then just rename them - it's a simple fix that takes all of 5 seconds.
Cheers,
Jonathan
Jonathan,
But its so much more than a files view!
I'll explain my set up, and hopefully all will become clear as to why its such a big deal.
To me, there are only two types of movies - movies the kids can see, and movies the kids cant. To facilitate this, I use profiles with two accounts, one for the kids and one for adults. I have configured two bookmarks - 'DVDs' and 'Kids DVDs', each bookmark relates to half a dozen physical shares. The adult profile needs a password, the kids profile doesnt. Its a shared libray.
Every movie is stored within the library, and has a file name that exactly matches the movie name as in IMDB - ie 'The Ant Bully (2006).ISO'. I have the 'Hide Media Extensions' option on, so that in file view, the file name is the movie name.
Under videos I have the 'View:Icons' option and 'Sort By:Name' and I get 15 IMDB thumbnails on each page, with the IMDB movie name underneath. This is perfect, everybody can find everything - its not just a files view, its a movie listing.
Considering I have 60 movies begining with 'The' , this latest change is a big deal. Especially since for the purist who wants to see all the files beginining with 'The' sorted together can just use the 'Sort By:File' option to get their desired effect.
It just seems a bizaar change - and for me it seems like a change for the worse. But don't get me wrong, I'm not complaining. Its an awesome product, the support is brilliant and like Keith says its just fantastic that we can do little changes to the code like this ouselves and fine tune it to our exact requirements - what more could an end user ask for? especially in a free product.
On a different note, I've looked through all the files relating to this, and I'm sure I could do the changes necessary to have two options for 'Ignore tokens when sorting' - one for library mode, and one for files mode. If I did all the changes, and everything works, is there any way I could get this into the main source code?
Cheers
Glen
jmarshall
2008-11-03, 00:51
Feel free to do up a patch - others may find it useful. I doubt it'll be added to be honest, as we have other plans in mind for the current files view, but that's just my personal opinion.
I thought I would lend weight to this discussion.
Personally I have been an XBMC enthusiast for years (I have 4, my brother has 2, my other brother has one, my mother has one, and I’ve converted about 6 other friends to XBMC). In the past I have bought old XBOXes and set them up for XBMC...now at home I run 3 XBOX based XBMC media centres and 1 Windows based).
I have always used the 'ignore tokens' option and i never use the library mode....same for all the people I’ve set up.
This changed behaviour is much worse in my opinion.
I would dearly love to have this option back the way it was for the many years I’ve used XBMC...I don’t mind if it’s an extra option, but I really prefer the way it used to be to the way it is now.
Please don’t take this as a rant, or a criticism of the great work being done by the team... please see this as what it is...am impassioned plea from a devoted and long time user.
Thanks
Feel free to do up a patch - others may find it useful. I doubt it'll be added to be honest, as we have other plans in mind for the current files view, but that's just my personal opinion.
I'm interested as I'm sure others are too... what other plans?
I almost never use Library view and always use File Views.
thx!
Jonathan, considering the popularity of this "feature", maybe we could introduce an AdvancedSetting to enable/disable this behaviour (in <video>)? Depending on your future "plans" you were talking about, I'd be willing to code something to implement it....
I've posted a patch for this which adds an advance setting to enable this behaviour.
http://xbmc.org/trac/ticket/5286
midgetspy
2008-11-06, 00:15
It seems to me that because the file view has so many additional features, people use it as it was never intended. It is supposed to be a way to view your files, like Windows Explorer. The fact that it displays fanart and all that fancy stuff is a bonus, but it's still meant to be a file view... if you want to view your media in some kind of media view it's expected that you'd use library view.
So IMO this should be explored: what is file mode doing that library mode isn't? Why do people use file mode for what library mode should be used for?
Perhaps there's some UI changes that can be implemented to make sense of all this. For example, maybe a 3rd view could be added so there's Files, Media, and Library... Library being db view, Media being a media-rich files view, and Files being a raw file explorer (like the Filemanager currently).
I've posted a patch for this which adds an advance setting to enable this behaviour.
http://xbmc.org/trac/ticket/5286
Cheers - I think I'm gonna have to learn how to compile XBMC myself now!
I've posted a patch for this which adds an advance setting to enable this behaviour.
http://xbmc.org/trac/ticket/5286
This is great goake, and thank you for doing this, but am I correct in understanding I'll need to apply this patch to the source code and compile the code myself?
And then with every release of XBMC, I'll always need to apply this patch to the source code and compile once again myself?
Yep, you'll have to patch & recompile everytime unless we commit it "upstream" but this is up to the devs...
Yep, you'll have to patch & recompile everytime unless we commit it "upstream" but this is up to the devs...
Well it seems that enough people want this feature available for optional configuration in the AdvancedSettings.xml file.
The code has already been written by goake, so it doesn't even require much effort from the devs.
Having it there is not going to hurt the devs that think it's unnecessary, and it will make the MANY people that do want it very happy.
I am beginning to think, the developers don't care that much about people who use their program.
Tonight, they are going to take over the world.
Yay, rule the world! Remember we're still in feature freeze so no new features will be added at this point. After the upcoming release the entire library/file views will be reworked.. so please be patient.
Yay, rule the world! Remember we're still in feature freeze so no new features will be added at this point. After the upcoming release the entire library/file views will be reworked.. so please be patient.
Are there plans to have the file view's able to show "cleaned up" names?
Example:
this...
The.Universe.s01e08.Saturn.Lord.of.the.Rings[HDTV]-LVI.avi
turns into (via RegEx magic)...
The Universe - s01e08 - Saturn Lord of the Rings.avi
juanpa74
2008-11-07, 06:20
I also support the feature and don´t understand the change.
On a side note. I name my movie files like this: Movie name - DIRECTOR (Year).
When using the library and trying to get the info from Imdb it would fail. I need to remove the DIRECTOR from the file name. Is there a way of parsing that? Sending to Imdb just the name and year without having to rename the file?
Thanks.
Are there plans to have the file view's able to show "cleaned up" names?
Example:
this...
The.Universe.s01e08.Saturn.Lord.of.the.Rings[HDTV]-LVI.avi
turns into (via RegEx magic)...
The Universe - s01e08 - Saturn Lord of the Rings.avi
It already does, except the removal of group/scene tags. Honestly i dont know what the new viewmode will look like, but feel free to create a new feature request.
I also support the feature and don´t understand the change.
On a side note. I name my movie files like this: Movie name - DIRECTOR (Year).
When using the library and trying to get the info from Imdb it would fail. I need to remove the DIRECTOR from the file name. Is there a way of parsing that? Sending to Imdb just the name and year without having to rename the file?
Thanks.
Just name them "movie - year.ext" and your done. Library mode will give you the director view.
keithskaggs
2008-11-07, 12:42
I have over 600 movies in my library and years ago I had to decide on a naming convention for the files. I choose to use the movie name as displayed in IMDB "movie (year).ext" and for movies with multiple files "movie (year).a.ext and movie (year).b.ext". This has the added benifit of almost always finding the correct IMDB info on a autoscan.
I don't use the library mode because I sort and store my files into catagories such as 'Children's Movies, Family Movies, Movies, HD Movies, Latest Releases, Music Videos, Documentaries'. This seems to work out well for my wife, grandchildren and guests to navigate.
Because of this was established years ago under the original XBOX with XBMC, ignoring "The" was important when trying to locate a movie. I personally hope this does become a permenant feature since I have had many complaints about it being removed from my family members trying to locate a specific movie.
Just my two cents.
Keith
juanpa74
2008-11-07, 17:47
The fact is that is how I want to name my files. I don't want to name them the way you want me too. Where is the freedom? I want a solution without having to change my filename. If there isn't one ok. But i just asked if there was one. Just say no there isn't.
What part of that do developers don't understand? I see people here asking for something or recommending something quite valid and the answer is: Do it like we want!
Again with library mode.. Can you see lots of users don´t like or want to use library mode? And is not that I always access my hard drives through xbmc. News flash!There are other modes to access our hard drives.Like from our computers! Is xbmc library mode going to help me there?
"Just name them "movie - year.ext" and your done". Why don't you come round and rename the hundreds files for me?Thanks.
It is like the developers don't want feedback from the users. Ideas that could improve the software coming from the people who use it. What is the problem with that?
I agree with mgboom earlier:
"I am beginning to think, the developers don't care that much about people who use their program."
Just name them "movie - year.ext" and your done. Library mode will give you the director view.
this is quite simple. you have three choices
1) rename files
2) implement a better system
3) stfu
whining is NOT on your list of options. sure we want feedback and ideas from our users. but that does not mean that we cannot disagree with, argue against or simply state that we find ideas useless and/or not worth the effort (this is what a lot of users seems to find hard to accept...)
It just drives me nuts that one developer doesn't use a feature, therefore decides for everyone else that they don't need it either.
someone please close this thread...
someone please close this thread...
Afraid of hearing more voices from people that disagree with what was done?
At this point, I'll probably just roll-back to a prior version of XBMC before the developer decided no one needed to filter out "The".
If you participated on this forum for more than just a few minutes every year, and we a bit more polite, you might get more positive attention... I've often been a voice that has disagreed and not been afraid to say so but I also frequent the forum.
But, this thread has gotten out of hand and is now OT...
If you participated on this forum for more than just a few minutes every year, and were a bit more polite, you might get more positive attention...
Well perhaps if all the developers didn't have the attitude of "it's been taken out, so deal with it or fix it yourself", then maybe my attitude would be better.
XBMC is an AMAZING application, and I have it on 3 devices in my house, 1 in my car, 1 in my wife's car, at 2 friends' houses, and at my brother-in-law's house. I'm a huge proponent of this application, so I just hate for 1 annoyance to spoil it.
using the application and participating/helping the community, two different things.
hopefully you'll survive this feature indiscretion...
(unsubscribing now)
jmarshall
2008-11-07, 23:50
mcowher: You are entitled to your opinion, and so are we.
We've explained why it was taken out, and we've also indicated that there's not much point changing it as we're planning to rewrite how the library/file mode interaction works (i.e. merge them in to one), thus making it a moot issue.
In the meantime, it's opensource, so feel free to build it yourself (trivial and doesn't cost you anything other than time) and change it to suit your whims.
This is my last comment on this issue.
Cheers,
Jonathan
We've explained why it was taken out, and we've also indicated that there's not much point changing it as we're planning to rewrite how the library/file mode interaction works (i.e. merge them in to one), thus making it a moot issue.
In the meantime, it's opensource, so feel free to build it yourself (trivial and doesn't cost you anything other than time) and change it to suit your whims.
This is my last comment on this issue.
Cheers,
Jonathan
Fair enough. Thanks Jonathan, and sorry for my ranting.
juanpa74
2008-11-08, 07:35
Why are developers so rude with users?
Just have to look at this thread..
I have been using xbmc and reading the forums for quite a long time.We are entitled to an opinion even if we hadn't post 1000 times!
I won't shut the fuck off. I made a simple question and got a rude answer.
I guess being a developer doesn't mean having manners.
So you can disagree but we can't? I guess some people don't deserve feedback. Others like johnsto (developer of the BBCiplayer plugin) are open to listen for suggestions from the users.
So how can you find an idea useless when lots of people are telling you that they ACTUALLY USE that? How is that useful option useless?
It is annoying how some developers when someone comes up with a good idea and ask if it can be done...Their automatic answer is: Do it yourself!
They seem not to be smart enough to know that if we knew howto do it we would do it.
And I am not whining. I am just telling like it is about the stupid and childish attitude of some people here.
this is quite simple. you have three choices
1) rename files
2) implement a better system
3) stfu
whining is NOT on your list of options. sure we want feedback and ideas from our users. but that does not mean that we cannot disagree with, argue against or simply state that we find ideas useless and/or not worth the effort (this is what a lot of users seems to find hard to accept...)
I think we need a bit of perspective here.
If you check this thread there are about 10 of us who prefer the file view to library view (myself included) who feel strongly enough to post here. We are hardly the strong majority - more like an insignificant minority.
Apparently there are changes planned to the whole library/files view area of XBMC. We are currently in a feature freeze - which has to happen every now and then. Need to stop developing new stuff and get rid of all the bugs with the current stuff. Adding new features all the time just introduces new bugs quicker than the exisiting ones can be fixed.
While we are waiting for the revamped version, it is really easy to sort this particular problem out yourselves - I did, I went from knowing nothing to fixing this problem in a couple of hours. The fix is now there, anyone can do it themselves.
We're not alowed to link to compiled code here - but if anyone needs some help they can PM me, I'll give an email addy and maybe we could sort something out. I hope that doesnt infringe any of the forum rules - I'm sure someone will put me right if it does.
In the meantime, it's opensource, so feel free to build it yourself (trivial and doesn't cost you anything other than time) and change it to suit your whims.
If we wouldn't appreciate all the work of developers of open source software, we wouldn't post at all at this forum.
But "only being a user", I think you w(sh)ould disagree with me.
2005george
2008-11-22, 23:37
Why are developers so rude with users?
Just have to look at this thread..
I have been using xbmc and reading the forums for quite a long time.We are entitled to an opinion even if we hadn't post 1000 times!
I won't shut the fuck off. I made a simple question and got a rude answer.
I guess being a developer doesn't mean having manners.
So you can disagree but we can't? I guess some people don't deserve feedback. Others like johnsto (developer of the BBCiplayer plugin) are open to listen for suggestions from the users.
So how can you find an idea useless when lots of people are telling you that they ACTUALLY USE that? How is that useful option useless?
It is annoying how some developers when someone comes up with a good idea and ask if it can be done...Their automatic answer is: Do it yourself!
They seem not to be smart enough to know that if we knew howto do it we would do it.
And I am not whining. I am just telling like it is about the stupid and childish attitude of some people here.
The developers aren't being rude to you, you are being rude and obnoxious to them. They told you at least 4 times the reason for the change, and that it wouldn't be changed back. For most people their reason makes perfect sense. A File View is a view of your files as they are named, it shouldn't be changing the naming of them. If you want them displayed differently then rename them or use a library view. When they give you an answer (that makes perfect sense to 99% of the community) stop harassing them and wasting their time, they already donate a lot of their time developing the product they don't need to waste time with people whining at them.
XBMC is a spectacular project and I use it on three XBoxes here. I have to say "me too" on this one -- I've gotten used to using file mode instead of library mode (because changes I make to the folders take effect on all three XBoxes immediately, because I can easily group things into folders myself, and because I like to separate the kid movies).
The new behavior of not ignoring "The" in file view has caused my very demanding customers here at the house to become cranky. I can't easily compile for the Xbox, so it sounds like I'll just have to go back to a prior build that has the "broken" behavior I like and wait for the new file listing to see if I like it.
Thanks to the whole XBMC team for a wonderful product!
This has been fixed/changed in SVN after all. The next binary release should ignore tokens again in filemode (when enabled).
Arnova, its only in the linuxport branch at the moment.
http://xbmc.org/trac/changeset/16179
Don't suppose theres any chance of you merging into it into the main trunk is there?
Thanks in advance
Well, actually it has already been merged to Xbox but it hasn't been committed to SVN yet. Will probably do this somewhere this week...
It seems to me that because the file view has so many additional features, people use it as it was never intended. It is supposed to be a way to view your files, like Windows Explorer. The fact that it displays fanart and all that fancy stuff is a bonus, but it's still meant to be a file view... if you want to view your media in some kind of media view it's expected that you'd use library view.
So IMO this should be explored: what is file mode doing that library mode isn't? Why do people use file mode for what library mode should be used for?
mcowher: You are entitled to your opinion, and so are we. We've explained why it was taken out, and we've also indicated that there's not much point changing it as we're planning to rewrite how the library/file mode interaction works (i.e. merge them in to one), thus making it a moot issue.
I must comment on this issue. There are a lot of opinions about this, and it seems like "the user base" is against removing this behaviour.
I as a user can see why the developers have taken this option out. And I want to take this even further. I see no use for a file view in any way, but the mediacenter software SHOULD take care of categorizing and scraping in a decent way. I think XBMC -at this point- is capable of doing this, as long as people name files according to standards that XBMC is comfortable with.
I have always found the "files view/library view" option strange. I think a user should set up directories that should be added to the libraries (no mather if this is music, movies, TV series) through the settings screen and that all other screens should display "library style".
It also took me some time to get comforable with the library view, but when you're used to it and follow "best practices" in naming files, XBMC will scan your content 100% and you get a far greater experience. XBMC media companion can eventually be used to scrape to .nfo files, so a rescan of the library doesn't take to much time.
treefour
2008-11-25, 13:40
I see no use for a file view in any way, but the mediacenter software SHOULD take care of categorizing and scraping in a decent way. I think XBMC -at this point- is capable of doing this, as long as people name files according to standards that XBMC is comfortable with.
First I am not complaining about the change it doesn't bother me either way, but I have to use the file view, because of the way I have my files categorized. My wife is not a native English speaker and I am. She needs subtitles to keep up with most English movies or shows, but there are shows and movies that she has no interest in and I do. I may be stupid, but I have found no way to effectively separate the subtitled movies/shows from the non subtitled in library view, thus leaving me with file view.
Again, I am neither for or against the debate here, just thought I would let you know there are some instances where file view is the more practical option.
I see no use for a file view in any way
Well many of us DO like and prefer File View. File View works "out of the box" with the folder structure we set up for our media, and allows us to manage that folder structure and organization outside of XBMC.
Well, actually it has already been merged to Xbox but it hasn't been committed to SVN yet. Will probably do this somewhere this week...
Thank you, thank you, thank you!! Many of us users will be very happy that this is being added back in to the official builds.
Well many of us DO like and prefer File View. File View works "out of the box" with the folder structure we set up for our media, and allows us to manage that folder structure and organization outside of XBMC.
Well, I'm not here to start a fight :laugh: All I wanted to point out is that I don't mind it being erased, since the only sound here is of people who want it back. I agree with you that some sort of custom categorization would be nice to have and this is not yet possible with the current library. This would be a nice feature and would make the filemode less needed :cool:
I think you might say that the reason for using file mode is the fact that the library mode lacks functionality (as was said earlier by midgetspy). If this is taken care of, we might not need file view anymore.
Well, actually it has already been merged to Xbox but it hasn't been committed to SVN yet. Will probably do this somewhere this week...
Please post back here when it is committed so I can get my functionality back.
I understand that the developers are doing their best and have to make decisions when coding. However, removing functionality is almost NEVER a good choice. The option was there; it worked and didn't interfere with anything else. As pointed out earlier, the combination of this option with a "Sort by" choice of files would make the file view sort by the file name. Sorting by "name" would quickly re-enable the option. This wasn't some backend change that people wouldn't notice. It is a very useful, and used, feature that, apparently, a lot of us want back.
Thanks to Arnova for reinstating it.
I merged (and committed) this yesterday to Xbox. Note that I also created an additonal trac report with a (IMHO) proper solution to this problem which should satisfy everyone: http://xbmc.org/trac/ticket/5366
Enorm bedankt!!! (Thank you very much!!!)
Thanks to Arnova for reinstating it
Credit due where credt is due, and I'm sure that Arnova wont mind, but it was spiff_ who did the change - http://xbmc.org/trac/changeset/16179
But thanks to Arnova for committing the changes so we can all get our hands on it easily.
Indeed: I don't mind and I won't take credit for it as merging/committing this change is trivial :-D
Enorm bedankt!!! (Thank you very much!!!)
Graag gedaan (That's "You're welcome" in Dutch ;-)).